The Power Plays Podcast

He Found The BEST One Person Business Model & Got RICH - Matt Shields Interviews Keaton Walker

• Keaton Walker

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From college dropout to 7-figure affiliate marketer: Keaton Walker shares his journey of building a successful agency, transitioning to affiliate marketing, and leveraging YouTube to become a top High Level affiliate. Learn how he earns $80K+ monthly and get actionable insights on niche marketing, lifestyle business, and maximizing affiliate income. Perfect for aspiring entrepreneurs and those looking to scale their online business.

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Matt:

What do you think is the better path towards financial freedom? Affiliate or building an agency? So what did you do to build an agency that was able to be sold? So

Keaton:

there's a few levers that you can pull. The obvious one is automation. How quickly did you start to see success from that? My very first client that churned was because the contractor I had hired was running the ads for the wrong business.

Matt:

How much have you made from affiliate commission for high level? A thousand. Bro, you're making more than Thomas Gannett on GHL. How many affiliates do you have?

Keaton:

I don't know if this number is accurate, but the high level dashboard is like 650.

Matt:

What are your biggest tips to being a successful affiliate marketer?

Keaton:

We had an email list. Of pretty much every orthodontist in the space and even though they hadn't opted in we would just Treat it as if yes, it was a broadcast email,

Matt:

dude That is that is a nugget. That is a nugget. All right, so I have this buddy mislov who's absolutely crushing it for his clients He's getting insane results for all of them And I want to show you guys how you might have heard me talk about this before But it's a software appoint wise mislov works with roofing clients and he set up a point wise You to use AI technology to nurture and qualify the leads for his clients. And then once it qualifies them, it actually books them into an appointment too, for the client. So, he doesn't need a ton of ISAs, the clients don't need to call the leads all day long, the AI does all the work, books the appointment for the client, and then the client just shows up once the lead's already vetted and ready to meet. He's been doing this for clients to get them five deals in two weeks. He got one of his clients 40 appointments in just 14 days. It's genuinely changing the agency space right now. If you sign up to AppointWise, that has daily live coaching calls on how you can build a seven figure AI agency business, which is what we're teaching right now. So if you want to see how that works, tap the link in the description below, sign up to a free trial of AppointWise. And that being said, let's get back to the podcast. So, Mr. Walker, you, you have become one of the top high level affiliates in the world.

Keaton:

It's true.

Matt:

And you've also built and sold a seven figure agency.

Keaton:

So,

Matt:

based on going down these two very different, but somewhat similar paths, what do you think is the better path towards financial freedom? Affiliate or building an agency?

Keaton:

Uh, we both know that the agency is a path to higher models, whether that's software, affiliate, um, Coaching for some people, at least for me, I do know some people that like run eight figure agencies and love it. And I think they're crazy because it's just so much work, so much overhead. Like, you know, they love what they do, but like, that's just not the lifestyle I want to live. So for me, like small agency, relatively small in the grand scheme of things to learn the skills. And then that will open up a world of like every origin story of click funnels, high level, whatever it is, like they started. in the agency space, seeing a problem. And then, you know, there's no better person to talk to than a bunch of other agency owners to figure out what problems in marketing you're going to solve.

Matt:

Yeah.

Keaton:

And then just go do that, whether that be affiliate or something else.

Matt:

So agencies to start and then affiliate to capitalize on the skills that you've built.

Keaton:

Yeah. Yeah. To build the lifestyle, I'd say like agencies, bottom line, it's not a lifestyle business. You can replace yourself, but. You're still going to be pulled in in different ways that you wouldn't in other other models

Matt:

I would say I got to about as removed from an agency as you could be and I still thought about it all the time Yeah, it sucks So I I feel you And it's interesting you bring that up like agencies really are the foundation of all online business If you look at the Hermosi, Gary V, Emon They're kind of like the three biggest names. I feel like all three of them are agency guys That's true. They all started from the agency space, so, um, maybe Matt Shields, Keenan Walker will be on that list one day soon, Mount Rushmore of agency gurus. So okay, so how did you, how did you get started in this? You've, you've, you have a YouTube channel, you, you've had quite the, the journey on YouTube, um, and it all started with you actually building an agency, but my understanding is you started in college and then you dropped out. So walk me through, how did you. Find this path. How did you go down this very untraditional, uh, route of building your own online business?

Keaton:

Yeah. So I wanted from a very young age to be an entrepreneur. I knew that. I saw my parents being business owners and like the flexibility that that afforded. Like, yeah, we were talking about business over the dinner table, like most nights, but also they could travel more. They were available more than my friend's parents. I just kind of like noted that I think. And like, even my mom, when we did like lemonade stands as a kid, like she would be given us like masterclass on product. Like, look, it can't be watery. It can't be warm. It's got, you know, if a bug falls in it, you throw it out and you do another cup for that customer. Like that kind of stuff is just what I grew up hearing. And then I, I'd hear my mom's customer service calls all the time as well. So I knew it's what I wanted to do. I just didn't know what. And, um, The family business was a swim school. I teach like babies up to like 10 years old, how to swim. And they were working on opening a new location. I was like 20 at the time and they needed someone to like figure out the whole marketing side of like, okay, how are we going to launch the new location? So my brother, who was the CEO at the time sat me down. He's like, okay. I talked to the founder of aqua tots, which is like a really big Franchise and they say like three main things when it comes to marketing, social media, building up stuff in the community. And I can't remember what the third one was, but I was like, okay, so community involvement and social media, like this is what I should do. So I just started to go down like every single path. And try to figure out what that was. So first it was like Kevin David videos on how to run Facebook ads. Like, I vividly remember like watching that on the toilet, like trying to figure out, and, um, and then, uh, I would do like events where we would like contact elementary schools and like get a booth at the event or, uh, I did a couple billboards or like. political, not actual political signs, but like those small signs that politicians put up, um, they're illegal technically, but like, they'll just, you can leave them up for a few weeks and then they'll just take them down. And like, nobody does anything about it. Um, and so I learned kind of, all right, there's all this stuff and what seems to be the least amount of work, but the most trackable is the ads. And it was what I enjoyed the most. I seem to have like a little bit of a knack for it. Yeah. And So just kept going down that path, got to the point where I was like a little bit out of my depth and I just needed somebody to like consult with and ask a couple of questions too. And friend of a friend contacted this kid. His Instagram was like, like thirst traps, like him being like really intense, all this stuff. And he ran an agency. He's like 17, finished high school early. And he was going to Stanford. I think he was running an agency on the side. Yeah. And I was like, no way this kid's legit. Like what's going on. And we ended up hiring him for a couple of months just so I can like kind of learn under him. And I saw him overwhelm this swim school with leads. Wow. Just like at first at launch, it wasn't that good. And then I saw him make a couple of tweaks and like overnight 20, 30, 40, 50, a hundred leads in like a couple of weeks. And we're like, okay, we got to shut this off. We've got to figure out how to text these people automatically. And that was a light bulb moment where I was like, Oh, like maybe marketing actually does work. That was the, the conversation I had with my brother. I was like, people don't like marketing. Does it work? Like all these big brands spend money on marketing, but like small business, like why are you going to market? Like it's just like put a sign up on the road and like people show up if they want to. And that was really eyeopening for me. And of course, as you start to research all of this stuff, your ads start to turn into. Started an agency, like, different gurus at the time, and so, I identified a guy that I thought, okay, this is legit, he seems cool. Who was it? Travis Stevenson. Travis Stevenson.

Matt:

Okay.

Keaton:

He's got crazy hair. Um, shout out to Travis, because he got me to buy my first course, but, yeah. The course was terrible. The software he had, he was, he had like a many chat alternative at the time.

Matt:

Okay.

Keaton:

And I was like, oh, I'm gonna like go with the small guy. Like, I don't want to support many chat. Like, they've got too many users. And it, it had like, I kid you not, one one hundredth of the functionality of many chat. And I paid like 1, 500 bucks for the course, which wasn't finished, and the many chat alternative, like a year of that. And I was like trying to build stuff, and I was like, this doesn't work. Like, I don't know what to do. And then I paid 10 bucks for many chat, like four weeks later. And like in a day, I was like, Oh my gosh, there's so much more built out here. So, uh, but yeah, that was my first course I bought in like January, 2019. And then, yeah, it was, there was just one day I was in school feeling like pulled in a million directions, like trying to pick a major, trying to get good grades, trying to. Enjoy my life just be young and I was trying to start a business I had a couple like free trial clients just some people in my warm network and I Was just like oh man, I think I can drop this whole school thing. And as long as I focus on actually Still the education side of things I'm gonna be successful. Like it's just a matter of the skills. It's not really a matter of the degree. Hmm And so I wish I had a burn the boats moment where I was like, and then I dropped all my classes, but I like finished the semester just to be safe. Um, and finished my last final and literally just like walk straight from my final to my dorm room and like pulled up the laptop and started working. And, uh, that's how it all started.

Matt:

And so you, you took the leap nonetheless. You may not have burned, had a crazy burn the boats story, but you did take the leap and how quickly did you start to see success from that? Like, did you start getting clients really, really quick? You had free trial clients, but did you start, how long did it take you to hit 10 K a month, for example?

Keaton:

Yeah. So I knew at the time that I needed a mentor because I had tried everything. Like I had tried buying that one course, which wasn't great. And then I was just trying to do everything on my own. And so I was like, okay, I need to hire someone because it got to the point where I was ready to launch the ads for the free trial clients. And I just had so much anxiety that it wasn't going to work. I was going to waste these people with money. Like they were people that I knew outside of work. Like they were, this could come back like in a personal relationship sense. So I really wanted it to work out. Um, and they were also e commerce clients, which I knew nothing about. So I just, I sort of told both of them like, Hey, You know, I don't think this is the right fit right now. And I reached out to Trey Cockrum, if you know him. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So Trey was my very first mentor. He was selling, um, like monthly coaching for like 1300 a month at the time, I think. And we just, it was mostly just mindset. Like that's Trey's strength. And so we got on there and he was like, do research, stop doing sales. Like, Like why are you going to try to like hard sell someone when like, it seems like you have some digital marketing knowledge, but like just go talk to people. And that one switch of research instead of sales got me reaching out to people in a, in a unique way that they weren't hearing. So it was like, Hey, I'm a digital marketing student. I want to talk to you about the things that I've learned about digital marketing for orthodontists. That was the niche that I decided to go after. And, you know, in exchange, I'd love to, just hear a little bit about your business model. So it was kind of like this value trade situation where I would help them with their business model, where I would talk, I would ask them about their business model. And then, um, I would just give them a little audit or like, Hey, there's, these are the suggestions. And the very first orthodontist I reached out to booked a call. We got on it and they closed like two weeks later.

Matt:

Wow.

Keaton:

So it was, yeah, it was like two weeks after I dropped out.

Matt:

This is very interesting because it seems so contrary to what is taught in the space right now. First, you're talking about how, in the very beginning, you mentioned how marketing was really effective for this school and you were like, Oh, marketing really works. I feel like now we're in a position in the space where like a lot of agency owners, their marketing is not working and everybody's like, SMMAs like this. You don't, you want to, you want to do it, but you don't want to go too deep into it because you're, you're scared what you're going to find if you pull back that curtain, right? And then on the other end, you're talking about research instead of sales. Again, I feel like the contrary is taught right now where it's like, sell, sell, sell. Fuck research, dude. You just got to go sell. Most of all, always be closing, like, never be researching. And so, um, I'm, I'm curious your opinion on kind of the, uh, Not to jump all over the place, but have you seen how the space has changed in that sense? It sounds like what you got started in, your kind of journey was much different than the average person getting started with an agency today. Um, you, you went a very, it seems like a different kind of route.

Keaton:

Yeah. I think it's just like the age of the person, to be honest. Like, somebody gets into SMA at 28, and they've got a few, like,

Matt:

Life experiences. Lots of life

Keaton:

experiences. They're going to be like, yeah, I'm not going to like follow this script that I got that's like obviously so cringy and like I'm asking 28 questions about how this is going to affect their wife and their kids and everything and I like barely met this person and I know nothing about them and they know nothing about me. Um,

Matt:

like if you're, how's your stepdaughter going to benefit

Keaton:

from this? If you're 20, you read that and I've, I've had students that I like, I've reviewed sales calls and I'm like, why, where did you get this script? And why? Like, let's just play it back. Like this guy's, the guy is literally begging on this sales call, like, tell me about your offer. I don't know. What is it? I, I'm really interested and the guy just keeps, the student who was following the script, just keeps saying like, okay, but how would this affect you? Like, okay, how much should I do it? Like, and again, if you, if you've grown up a little bit, you're able to take some of that intuition. Um, I think I may have mentioned this last time when we did the podcast on my channel, but like Pablo Picasso said some of his first works were his best works. Hmm. And. There's something to be said for that intuition. And so I think that when Trey said that thing about research and not sales, it just sat right with me. And for all the hype, like I think once you get into the coaching programs, there's a lot of people recommending or they should be, in my opinion, recommending that. And there's a lot more success stories like mine and that actually seems to be because I don't know, it's survivorship bias. Like the people with the like really crazy sales personalities, um, you know, they can build something up super quickly. That's what gets pushed. That's the click bait. They watch a few videos, people watch a few videos of that and they're like, okay, this is what I have to do. When in reality, they didn't realize that that person built up to 30 K a month, burned down the agency the next month because everyone churned and, you know, built a personal brand off that. And now it's like, yeah, but

Matt:

at least they hit 50 K one month.

Keaton:

Yeah. So I, I think the, the real like. The real people, like you go to an event and you meet the people in real life who are like, yeah, this works obviously. And like, I'm doing well, I'm providing for my family and I'm not 22 and just like basically scamming people out of their money. They built a much more slow burn type of agency that started out with understanding their market, Understanding the problems that they needed to solve and actually getting good at the problem before they try to solve.

Matt:

So you took that path of understanding which I think I'm glad we dove into it because not enough people actually hear that these days And follow that so you took that path And then how long to hit your first 10k month? Let's say

Keaton:

it was like six months

Matt:

six months. Okay, so pretty decent time I mean pretty quick if you really think about it But also you think about the internet marketing where we have is like bro took you more than 12 days. Yeah Um, so

Keaton:

that was six months from going full time,

Matt:

right? You were already doing it before

Keaton:

yeah, and I was learning digital marketing before and like I was just talking to an old student today and he He finally hit 10k and we've been working working together off and on for like three years. And he's like, dude, we can do an interview. We'll call it. Oh, let me redo that. He's like, dude, we can do an interview. We'll call it zero to 10 K in three years.

Matt:

Dude, that'll get clicked, bro.

Keaton:

And I'm like, he's like, Oh, but maybe that's not in your best interest to serve that narrative. And I'm like, it's absolutely my best interest. Cause I don't want to attract the zero to 10 K in 12 days crowd. Um, but like, yeah, I, I just said, there it is. I said six months when in reality it was. 18 from when I started, or really 12 from when I, the first time I watched, uh, like here's how to run Facebook ads video, 14 months.

Matt:

Wow. And so this guy, it took him three years, which you think about, you're like, Oh, that's so long. But like most people, three years after they start online business, they're not even in online business anymore. They quit. It's like, this guy has taken three years. But now he's making six figures. He's making and he got paid to learn now. He's making six figures Most people go to school for four years, get 70k, 100k in debt, and then they come out maybe with a 60k a year job. So if you just, it's just, it's cool to hear that and I hope people's perspectives will be kind of shifted from this, uh, Yeah. This shiny, sexy, biz op world that we live in right now. Yeah. Um,

Keaton:

One more thing I wanted to add about him, the person I was just talking about, is that he, he's like, it took me two years to actually take it seriously. Mm. Mm. And that's okay. Like, if you want to side hustle this thing, until you can prove it to yourself that this stuff works, do it. Like don't, we're all in such a rush to be millionaires by 25 that like, you know, you're, you give away your youth, like slaving away behind a computer and like, yeah, there's benefits to that. But it's also okay to just be like, yeah, I'm earning some money. Like I'm traveling, I'm just enjoying my life. And then, The time will come where you don't have to go out of your way to buy a 10, 000 mastermind at 22 that's going to like level up your mindset or whatever, because you're just there, you're like, my mindset is here, I'm good. And you're buying that mastermind not to, out of lack, not out of want. But you're just like, I'm ready for the next step. And I know this is going to work anyway, but this is going to speed up my process.

Matt:

I agree in the sense of like people do rush. And the biggest reason people fails because they rush. So six months of going all in, you get to 10 K, 14 months after watching your first Facebook ad video, and did you kind of experience the snowball effect where like, boom, after the 10 K it took like three months to get to 30 or like, How did things start progressing after you got that first 10k because everybody says first 10k is the hardest?

Keaton:

Yeah, so I think towards the end of that year that would have been like end of 2019. I was doing Maybe like 11, 12 there. That's when churn started to happen because I wasn't doing every single part of it myself. And I started to outsource and some things fell through the cracks. And, uh, my very first client that churned was because the contractor I had hired was running dads for the wrong business on the right. Yeah, that'll do it. It's like, what is this business? Like you're fired. I'm like, fair.

Matt:

Didn't even find it. Yeah.

Keaton:

Um, And that I had been dreading, but also kind of looking forward to the first day that I turned a client because I, it hadn't happened, it had been like seven months. Wow. I was like, okay, what's gonna happen? And, and I still to this day have my first three clients. What? Simply because today? Yeah., like, they, they weren't included in the sale of the business for Oh, really? A reason. I'll explain in just a second, but it's because I onboarded them and like, again, the Pablo Picasso principle, like I just, I knew. I knew how to treat them right, you know, like I knew that this income to me was super important and also getting results and just treating them right as my first three clients. And, you know, four years later, I'm still collecting a check from them every month and getting them good results. So it's kind of cool.

Matt:

That's really cool. Keep a client for four years. That's, that's impressive.

Keaton:

So, but as far as the snowball effect you mentioned. Um, I ended up partnering with somebody the very start of 2020, so we were sort of like in talks end of 2019 and we decided to keep, like, we kept the agencies that we currently had and then we just started a new one together and we could use those case studies, but like we owned the revenue and they sort of slowly, like some clients churned, but then, you know, the core of those businesses always stayed and that was always ours to deal with directly. Um, And so that new agency we started from scratch by the end of 2020 was doing like 30, 35k a month.

Matt:

Wow, by the end of 2020, so it went from 10k to 30k in how many months?

Keaton:

Uh, probably about 12, yeah.

Matt:

12? Yeah. And so what, what was your peak month that you got that agency to?

Keaton:

Uh, like 85.

Matt:

85, so seven figs. Okay, so start. So from start to how long did it take to go from zero to 85k long?

Keaton:

Um, zero to 85k. Let's see. That would have been like May of 2020. What are we in 2024? Yeah, that would have been May of 2022. So like three years.

Matt:

Three years. Okay, so gradual process, right? Um, and then you were able to sell this agency, which is incredible because Most people never sell their agencies. Yeah, I'm most people Unfortunately, it's so it's a very it's a very rare feat in this space to be able to sell a marketing agency And that's got to feel so good. I mean,

Keaton:

yeah,

Matt:

did it feel amazing when you sold?

Keaton:

Yeah It did and I don't want to like I was talking to somebody else shout out to Avery Lynch if anyone knows him But he was like I really, like, I had an ad I was running at one point that talked about the valuation of my agency when we sold, which was half a mil. So it's not like an insane number. And even that was a, like, a little bit inflated, I would say. And the terms of the deal didn't work out exactly like that. But like, no, have no delusions. Like your million dollar a year agency is not selling for much. You're not going to get a 10x multiple. Because it's about EBITDA most agency owners actually don't even have EBITDA because they're paying themselves out of all the excess and there's no, there's no anything left over after the owner's salary cause they're taking everything out every month. Um, but the agency that purchased us, we got in touch with them because I was in a, uh, agency coaching group at the time. And they were friends with the owner of that group. And I reached out, I was kind of feeling like a little bit of burnout, a little bit of like, I'm not sure if I want to be in a partnership anymore. Like I'm, I think I'm ready to go back on my own. There was some really positive things about the partnership, but there's also positive things about being on your own. And he was like, Hey, I was actually talking to these guys. They were talking about buying you. And I was like, Oh really? So we started the talks with them in April. May, around right when we hit like 85k and then the sale went through February 1st of the next year.

Matt:

Wow. So it took a decent amount of time.

Keaton:

Yeah. A lot of due diligence. I changed the deal a couple of times and that was part of why it took a few extra months. Uh, cause originally I was going to stay on with them for like potentially quote unquote permanent. Um, but decided that wasn't the right fit after some of the more due diligence, like I had nothing against them. They're awesome. I just wasn't, I knew I wouldn't thrive in that environment. Um, and it was more of a like, hey, I'm going to skill stack, like I'm going to stay in, I'm going to learn so much. And then I'll, you know, I'll have, I'll be able to do whatever I want in a couple of years. And I was like, maybe I'm at that point now, like maybe I've actually got the skills. And just talking to a few mentors, like gave me the confidence to be like, no, I'm going to go out on my own. Hmm. It's, yeah, it's worked out way better than I thought it would have, so.

Matt:

Yeah, and I want to get to what you're doing now in a second, because you're living the life. But, before we do, selling an agency, like we said, is something most people never do. And yet, everybody should be trying to work towards building a sellable agency, even if you never sell it. Um, Being able to have a business that could be sold is a sign you've built it the right way. So what did you do to build an agency that was able to be sold? Like, what were the kind of the main things that you created that made it even eligible to be sold?

Keaton:

Yeah, so there's a few levers that you can pull. The obvious one is automation. Like, can this function without you? Yep. Um, which I wouldn't even say I had done an amazing job of. Like, we were getting to that point, but I was still very much involved in the day to day. Um, and that obviously limits your number of buyers if you're still involved, but also it's not, if you're selling to another agency, which a lot of agencies will, like they know how to manage a team. They know how to run the campaigns. Like they can get by with a three to six, six month consulting period from you. You don't have to be a hundred percent removed. But another friend of mine, Luca Good, um, has sold an agency and he said, in his own words, build it like the laziest person possible. And I think that, that sort of has to do with removing yourself, but it more has to do with simplifying. And for example, like using a software like Apex or Play is another one where a lot of people call it ply, but apparently it's pronounced play.

Matt:

What does that do?

Keaton:

Uh, It allows you to launch ads in like three clicks instead of having to go. Yeah. Yeah. Play is, but they have way more platforms. Um, so you can, you can take literally one creative and you can launch it across Snapchat, Tik TOK, Facebook, Instagram, like everything. Um, but taking that, like investing, let's say 500 a month into a software like OPEX, that's going to take off. 20 to 30 hours a month of manual labor. And investing in those templates and the SOPs and, um, just not even like removing yourself and having other people do it, but how much of this can be done by AI today or software. That's huge. Cause then you're, you're more of a hybrid, like, okay, this is a system that I'm buying versus, uh, I'm buying a business with. the employees and all that kind of thing. And that will get you a higher multiple and make you more attractive

Matt:

like that

Keaton:

because people can plug it in right away. Um, but then the second thing is, is differentiators. So like on the front end of the business, like what makes you attractive to people that is different than everybody else in the marketplace? So for us, our competitor that ended up buying us was losing deals to us because we had an employment setting service. So, we would call the leads, we would get access to the practice management software, we would book them directly in the practice management software. And, you know, there was obviously some price differences in their model versus ours, but they were still losing the deal even though they provided a lot more services. Because it was like, Oh, I, I just, I don't want to call the leads. And so they, they were hearing our name get brought up as a reason why their deals weren't going through, which is like a flag. Um, and then also they had kind of seen us just around the community in general. Um, and lastly, like the, the retention from that appointment setting service and program was. So good that, you know, obviously that increased the multiple, how we were doing, et cetera. And, and the differentiation of the market and the brand we had built. Uh, and that's the last point I forgot to mention is the brand. So I would get on sales calls and the orthodontist would say, I see your face every day. Or, Hey, I watched like five of your customer interviews. Like I've seen you guys around. And I'm ready to sign up. I just had a couple of questions and that brand equity, if you will, actually was lent a little bit to the other company, which has a ton of brand equity as well, but acquiring that, like the things that they talked about in the process were, Hey, there's a brand we want some of the IP around the appointment setting, um, and. You know, sometimes when we lose deals, it's going to you guys. So that attracted somebody that wouldn't have really given us a second thought.

Matt:

Otherwise. So orthodontist was the niche and we're doing just typical Facebook ads. Yeah,

Keaton:

we did, um, a lot of Facebook messenger stuff. So a lot of many chat,

Matt:

huh? Did that get good results?

Keaton:

Yeah. So there was one campaign that like this, the origin story of this is hilarious, but there's My former business partner worked with a, an orthodontist out of Arizona. That's like the top there. They're like the lower end of, of price in Arizona, but they have a lot of locations and they like, he's much more businessman than an orthodontist. And he's really focused on the business side and enjoy the marketing and all that kind of thing. And he has tested every campaign known to man for an orthodontist. Uh, you know, you want something like info on how to run campaigns for orthodontists. You should be talking to him. And I just happened to find his stuff as I was doing research on the niche, ended up paying for a call for him and he previously had built an agency of a, you know, a hundred plus orthodontists, ended up shutting it down 'cause it was just too much work and a distraction from his practice. Um, but he was like, yeah, if I were to start an agency again, this is what I would do. This is what I would charge. This is a campaign I would run like. I paid like 300 bucks for that call. What? He gave me the blueprint, right?

Matt:

And you just followed it. Yeah. And it worked.

Keaton:

Yeah, so that one, that campaign started to decline in performance in some areas towards the end of the agency. Like any word to the wise, any template you have will run in cycle for, I would say, 80 to 90 percent of clients. Like, there's some random clients that for whatever reason, the weirdest, but what I was going to say is the people that it does work for, that's just like, I don't, it seems like I can't do anything wrong here. Like whatever I touch in this market turns to gold. And there's still some, um, clients that are running that type of thing. But as I started to transition into like more of a oversight role in the agency and not doing as much of the. Work in the trenches. We started to see, okay, like this campaign does perform really well sometimes, but when it doesn't perform, we're losing the client. Like, what do we do? And we started working a lot on R and D in terms of like what we're going to run. Templates wise and so we would start to launch two campaigns at the same time see which one would do better Allocate more spend to the better one decrease the other one Maybe turn them off all together and that just helped us get the quick win for the client a lot faster But yeah, Facebook ads GHL appointment setting where we'd call the leads and book them into the schedule. So your answer is Yeah.

Matt:

And how did you get these orthodontists? Were you cold calling? Were you running paid ads? Were you doing cold email?

Keaton:

I would say this is maybe another part of the differentiation thing is that I barely did outreach after 10k. Really? Yeah, because we had a YouTube channel where it wasn't that tons of people found us through the YouTube channel, but they would find us maybe through a blog article or maybe through ads or maybe through something else. And then they would go to our website and then they would see we had a YouTube channel and then they'd binge watch five videos and they'd be like, Oh, this is cool. And then they get on the call. So that like combo play of how can I do, how can I be everywhere really lent itself to us building a brand. And I invested heavily in like, how can we be perceived the right way? How can this brand actually be something where you like, you look at an iPhone and you're like, this looks good. This feels sleek. That kind of thing. And so, I had, I would just friend orthodontists on Facebook and eventually I just stopped DMing them. At the beginning I would DM them, I hated doing it, so I was really glad to be able to stop doing that. I would make YouTube videos, uh, we would run ads, the niche is so small that we only had to spend like 400 bucks a month on ads. What? Yeah, and it was just like, awareness after a certain point, where it was like, okay, they're seeing us every day. Wow. And then this is a, I'm about to draw some sauce. That's dope . But we had a, an email list of pretty much every orthodontist in the space. And even though they hadn't opted in, we would just treat it as if Yes, it was a broadcast email.

Matt:

That's fine. Did you do that? No. Okay. So, dude, that is, that is a nugget. That is a nugget. I'm so, it's actually so cool to hear you say this because I've always wondered, Hmm. Why don't people just like add you to, uh, uh, ActiveCampaign or a MailChimp sequence even if you haven't opted in, like, just, it's just like cold email but on steroids and just continue to email them every week. And so you actually did that. You're the first person I've met who's actually done that, but I've always wondered, hi, could you, could you get away with this?

Keaton:

Yeah, and I think it, um, I don't know. They're cracking down on more email stuff. We won't talk about

Matt:

the legality of

Keaton:

this method. I've talked to one student who we tried a little bit of it, and I don't know, I don't think we tested it extensively enough to be able to report on details here, but the list was like 10K, and we'd send an email or two, get a couple appointments, and it was great. And funny story, I was coaching my nephew's soccer team, and I see the other coach like has like an orthodontics. Logo on his shirt, and I was like, oh Hey, like, are you an orthodontist? He's like, yeah, you look familiar. And he pulls up his email. My face is in his email and we'd never met. Like, he was like, I don't even know how you got my email. I was like, yeah, maybe you opted into something.

Matt:

Yeah. You didn't want to tell him the truth on that one.

Keaton:

Anyway. Yeah. Actually,

Matt:

I'm, I illegally found your information. Blowing you up, actually. Wow.

Keaton:

But it's, it's actually a very viable, like you can scrape. Nowadays it's not hard to scrape. You just buy a list from somebody. Yeah, People that have, they're like, yeah, worth it on us? Sure.

Matt:

Here they

Keaton:

all are. Everybody has the same list. Literally.

Matt:

I'm going to do this for agents. Dude, I'm going to do this point wise. I've been talking, I've been thinking about it for a while. Just get a ton of agency owners, buy a list. This one guy has a list of 80, 000 people. I'm like, I'll just buy the list. And cold email all these 80, 000 agency owners every week. Send them

Keaton:

video, send them case studies, talk about results. Like nobody's getting mad off that. Like, yeah, there's people unsubscribing. Like, Hey, I didn't opt into this.

Matt:

You can do this to blow up a YouTube. You could do this for a lot of things. Like you could make a YouTube video and then. Because Joel Kaplan used to do this, anytime he made a video, he would send it to his email list. He would say, hey, check out my video. That's how he like got views and built his audience. You could do that with like a random YouTube channel. You just find your niche, say, hey, put whatever the title of the video is in the thumbnail or in the email subject line. Then you just link your video and you can just like start. It's just another way to build audience and it's so interesting. So interesting. I'm gonna, I'm going to try this. I'm going to report back to you. Yeah, report

Keaton:

back. I'll let you know how it goes. I, it's not something I've, I think it's the first time I've said it in public, so.

Matt:

Wow, we're getting in that, we're getting in that secret sauce. Wow, okay, we've gotten a lot of, a lot of good story and a lot of good nuggets here. Tell me, Keaton, what are you up to these days? What are you working on now? You have, uh, you're doing some cool stuff and I think it's very, It's very unique what you've built. Um, so yeah, what are you, what are you working on these days?

Keaton:

Yeah. So when I was kind of in the partnered agency, like, I don't know, I'm an entrepreneur. Like I just can't, I felt a little bit constrained by having a partner. And so I always wanted to do something that was, uh, outside of that, that was just my own. And so I would make YouTube videos. And one day I just woke up and I was like, Hey, like, maybe I can make a video about high level. Like, I know it pretty well. It seems like it's kind of starting to catch fire. Like more people are signing up and I might get some affiliate revenue, like, you know, maybe a couple hundred bucks a month. That'd be cool. So I just made the video and that was my top performing video at the end of the year. And I was like, huh, maybe I should do that again. So I did it again. And it was how, how I use high level versus how to use high level the second time. And then that was my best performing video. And then I was like, well, what if I like took this more seriously with some good production value and like started making individual tutorials and I started doing that every time. Didn't matter what it was. High level was in the title. I seem to rank at the top. People seem to like the style. And I was talking to somebody at our, our local meetup group and, uh, Brett Linencole who's, yeah, he's going to be on, he'll be on my podcast. I don't know when this is coming out, but sometime around this comes out probably. And he, um, on that podcast asked me like, what's your superpower? And I was like, I don't even know. Like, but then he told me a week later, he's like, I think it's taking big ideas and instilling them down to like easy to understand concepts. And I, uh, a mentor of mine that I really love and respect Spencer Mecham, Buildapreneur if anyone knows him. Um, his story I interviewed him and he's like, when I didn't try, that's when I succeeded. Like the thing that I was just like, whatever, like this probably won't work, but it's easy enough to do. I'll try it. Boom. 50, 000 in affiliate commission in two months or whatever. Yeah. So I would say that's kind of what happened to me where I was, I was making SMMA content. I was making high level content and people just happened to like the way that I explain things. They said, my voice is like, yeah. Like monotone enough that like they can listen to it for like an hour on an explanation video like that and I was just like, I don't know. It's just this thing where the stars align like apparently i'm I Have the perfect set of traits to do this And so that the affiliate income has grown to More than I ever would have dreamed And, um, then on top of that, I have a few, like many courses, some coaching that I've, I've currently not coaching right now, just on a bit of a sabbatical from it to recharge. Um, but then the other question has been, how can I. Increase that affiliate income and not have it so centered on one software,

Matt:

right?

Keaton:

And so i've been making reviews of other add ons for high level even just other competitors for high level Exactly

Matt:

Um,

Keaton:

and just it's so smart though

Matt:

It's because high level there's now there's so many things you can be an affiliate for that are on high level To where like you get your high level base Yeah, and you just figure out well What other things can I affiliate for that people who use high level need and it's like a never ending Affiliate pyramid. In a good way. Yeah, the

Keaton:

best way.

Matt:

Dude, so can I ask how much have you made from affiliate commission in for high level?

Keaton:

About 500,

Matt:

000. 500 grand. And that's just all profit basically. I know what I'm doing. So. That's sick.

Keaton:

Yeah, it's that like. We'll do like 80k this month.

Matt:

This month? Uh

Keaton:

huh.

Matt:

80k? Yeah. Bro, you're making more than Thomas Gannett on GHL. Come on, Thomas. You gotta step it up. Dude, that's, that's insane.

Keaton:

Yeah, it's, I, I can't believe it. Um, honestly, those numbers are small. Like, yeah, I may be top, I would say I'm top 25, maybe, in monthly. Maybe. Probably top 15. Who's number

Matt:

one?

Keaton:

All time, Matt DeSeno, I think.

Matt:

Really?

Keaton:

Yeah.

Matt:

Rob Bailey's got to be up there all time too, right?

Keaton:

Yeah, all time, probably Rob, but right now it's a monthly, probably Jason Wardrobe.

Matt:

I was going to say, dude, he's got to be doing what, 250?

Keaton:

Uh, I talked

Matt:

to him in person, but I don't want

Keaton:

to say.

Matt:

Oh, I guess you can't say, you can't say. I thought it might be public information. But I just know I'll get him on here one of these days. Wow.

Keaton:

Yeah, I'll connect you, but he's It's so funny cause he also like he did the grind of like building a real software company that basically, basically it was GHL plus Alpex, but he paid for all the dev cost himself before GHL was the thing before Alpex was the thing.

Matt:

Oh wow.

Keaton:

And he sold it around the time. This was all, you know, high level started to take off and I would assume that he's making more profit from. Being an affiliate, then running his own software company. Oh, heck yeah, dude. Yeah.

Matt:

Yeah. If he's the number one high level affiliate, he's making some bang. Um, and software company, dude. It's so expensive. He would have had to really have scaled that software. Because even Uphex now is probably, I mean, anyway, I won't speculate. Um, incredible. Okay, so you're running a seven figure YouTube channel is one way to think about it. Yeah.

Keaton:

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, like last month, all in was like 100k, so, if we

Matt:

And that's

Keaton:

profit? That's, I mean, the team, the team is like, Like, 5 to 10, depending on the month.

Matt:

Yeah. Yeah. That's pretty crazy. Um, how much do you make in AdSense off YouTube? Do you make any money off that?

Keaton:

Not much. My AdSense sucks. 3k a month? Uh huh. Dang. What about you?

Matt:

Like my best month, well, I just set it up like a month ago.

Keaton:

Oh, that's so It's yeah,

Matt:

I haven't made any adsense money at all. Why don't

Keaton:

you turn it on?

Matt:

I was just lazy, bro You know what? I'm realizing I bet

Keaton:

I bet you would have had 100k so far

Matt:

Three and a half million views.

Keaton:

Yeah

Matt:

Don't say that to me he and dude, you know when we did our first podcast You made a joke. You're like, yeah, I don't mind selling out like you jokingly said that and I was like, you know, what? I've actually lost so much money. I've made so much less money not selling out. And I really am questioning, I really have a question, like, did people really care that much? Like, would people really, how many people would have been like, oh, Matt's selling a course? Like, a few.

Keaton:

Yeah.

Matt:

It would have been a sick course. Like, I could have, like, would that many people really have stopped watching me if I started promoting high level? Yeah. Probably not. Yeah. I, I think. I think I got it wrong, and I want to blame it on somebody, but I can't. It's

Keaton:

not too late.

Matt:

It's not too late, but I mean, I'm making my move now. It's just like a year and a half after. Yeah, that's true. And you want to do it while you're hot and on the rise, and

Keaton:

Yeah.

Matt:

Dude, I lost, I lost, so it's been, it's It's bittersweet for me to hear, um, how you're doing. It's incredible. But I'm also just like, damn, dude. I messed up. So, are you still doing coaching or you're done with coaching and it's just affiliate?

Keaton:

Um, I just, like, some stuff has happened personally where I'm like, I've just been on being an entrepreneur on my phone, on calls, on like, available 12 hours a day. six days a week, maybe a little less than that. Like I, I'm not actually working like hours in front of a computer. I'm sure you and everyone else blow me away, but like being available, I'm pretty good at that. And I have been for a long time, but that comes at the cost of like family time and just being present and all that kind of thing. And so we've just been trying to make a big move towards that. A

Matt:

big move towards not having to be 24 7?

Keaton:

Yeah, just to be, like, be able to take real time off where you're not having to answer anything. Like, the only time I think I've done that in the last two years are, it's like, uh, probably two and a half weeks total of, in the last five years. Wow. No phone, not responding to anything, not doing anything. And one was my honeymoon and one was just like a week that I took. So, um, yeah, I just, I, it got to the point where I was like, okay, I don't need this coaching income. I mean, not, I'm doing okay financially anyway. Like I could shut it down, but I, it was just, the juice wasn't worth the squeeze at the point. And I didn't want to hire a sales team and scale it and deal with all of that. And I also. Um, was a struggle with the demands on like me personally because the way I want to run it, like I want to be the one talking to people. Um, and so I'm just regrouping and figuring out what's next because I do really enjoy it. But, um, you don't

Matt:

even need it, right? I mean, like, no, I

Keaton:

don't, but I, I, it's good for another

Matt:

20 K a month. It's kind of like, why take on the stress,

Keaton:

dude? Yeah, it keeps me sharp. Like I can talk to people, I'm dealing with real problems. I'm seeing what's going on and I can kind of pattern match that and help other people. Um, it exposes me to new ideas, which I really enjoy. Um, but I've, you know, I've been doing it. I've done coaching almost since probably the second year of the agency, just cause people started to reach out and not full time by any means. But yeah, it just got to the point where this same stuff that used to bring me, um, Tons of joy was like starting to feel kind of monotonous and like I'm like I think I just need a break from this and then I'll come back and we'll figure out what the structure and the model looks like because I love talking to smart people about what they're doing and Helping them and there's so much unlock that can happen in a single consulting session that that's like I live off that I really thrive off. You enjoy it. Yeah, and I do that with the affiliates like I just this morning We did a 90 minute call and like it's just free if you're an affiliate you come on. Smart. That's once a month. Um, and then I bring on a guest as well. But like

Matt:

How many affiliates do you have?

Keaton:

Um, I don't know if this number is accurate but the high level dashboard is like 650. I

Matt:

feel like it could be even more.

Keaton:

Yeah, I think, well there's a sub affiliates as well. Right. And I, I, I don't trust that number on the dashboard.

Matt:

That's sick dude. Okay. So let's talk about affiliate marketing, I guess a little bit because this is something you've. I mean, you've reached like the top 1 percent of the top 1 percent of affiliate marketers, dude, 80k a month. It's just, it's incredible. And I, I have so much more appreciation for the affiliate business model after seeing what you and like Thomas have done. I've never took affiliate marketing seriously. I always thought pyramid scheme, BS, scam, like stay away from it. Until I saw what Thomas did with his YouTube channel and just like blew up and then, you know, created this value Offer that all tied back to the software and then went on to like he just crossed a freaking million uh in affiliate income and then on like I didn't realize you were a high level affiliate king like that until like a couple months ago, actually. So then I saw, I was like, oh wait, Keaton's crushing this too. Um, Jason Wardrop, who I've been watching for like ever, right? He's been, he's an OG in the agency space. In the real estate space. In the real estate space too.

Keaton:

Yeah.

Matt:

And so I'm just seeing all these guys crushing. I'm like, okay, maybe this is a business model that should be taken very seriously Especially with how content is starting to become Really the the oil of of the world is attention now. And so people can either build their own products or they can make money Affiliating for being affiliated with other products, which is really what Logan Paul is with like prime

Keaton:

Yeah,

Matt:

it's really just a glorified affiliate who has a percentage in the business, right? You Um, and so I want people to take this seriously and I want to humble myself and take this seriously because I used to not and now, uh, I've completely changed and it's, it's cool to hear your story on, on how much success you've had. So, okay, what, what are your biggest tips to being a successful affiliate marketer? Is it just simply figure out content or is there more to it? Like, how do you make money with affiliate marketing?

Keaton:

Yeah, so the first thing I'd say. Is that from a lifestyle perspective, I don't think there's a better model. Like you don't have to build the product. You don't have to service the product afterwards or service to people on it. And like, I love poor Mosey, love his content, but a lot of his stuff is just like more and more and more, like how can you get more people to work for you? More customers. So then there'll be more views and then you get more customers and you have more events and like, you're just making more money. And I'm like, dude, I'm tired. three sentences into what you just said, like I, I'm tired and I didn't even do the work. And I'm, I'm just kind of like slow and methodical like that. And I, I know hopefully everyone listening to this podcast knows how important recurring revenue is. Like from a psychological standpoint, being able to count on next month being X amount or whatever, And starting there versus starting at zero with a lot of like high ticket coaching stuff, even though you may be making and potentially profiting more than me, you've still got to start at zero and like chase people down and like manage your sales team and all that kind of thing. Um, and certainly agencies are like, there's just more to do in service and worse margins. So. If that's attractive to you and you're more of a lifestyle type person, then I would highly consider focusing on being an affiliate marketer because it is actually, it's, it's kind of like going to work in like software sales except you don't have to have a boss breathing down your neck and you can sell at scale. Um, at its core, affiliate marketing is just, Hey, I had a story that helped me get onto this product. And this product can also help you in the way that it helped me and all of these other people use my link and maybe nothing or use my link and I'll help you. Um, I think People don't understand how much the software space has changed affiliate marketing because it used to be just one off commission,

Matt:

right? Now highlight high levels change the game, dude. Yeah

Keaton:

Yeah But even like like click funnels did it before they made a couple in my opinion bad moves about how they handled the switch from Click funnels classic to 2. 0 like resetting that whole affiliate thing like people that had been really really loyal to them Got a sour taste in their mouth because they They were like, okay, free for all. Like you can steal everybody else's affiliates when they go to 2. 0. And I think a lot of other software companies will be like, if you haven't referred someone in the last two years, then we're going to cut your commissions. Uh, convert kit, for example, is commissions for only two years, which obviously is fair, but like. There are companies like High Level, uh, System. io is another one, that are giving lifetime, it's like baked into their contracts, it's baked into their sale contracts, like it is, it is as sure as affiliate revenue can get, like I understand that, you know, it's not as, um, good as owning your own revenue, but like, let's be honest, if you're an influencer, The platform could shut you down at any time like I don't even see what I do as entrepreneurship. Like I just see it as like this weird money glitch on the internet I can do money. You've discovered the infinite money glitch, bro What the heck? But it's it's true, right? Like it's it's just don't take yourself too seriously. Like all you're doing is referring people. So Like, yeah, you have a business yard, you're an entrepreneur, but like, you're not really like don't reinvent the wheel. Just talk about what you're good at talking about and then say, Hey, here's the value.

Matt:

So you still kind of need to get that experience in entrepreneurship first to have something to talk about. Like, don't you need to have some sort of credibility for someone to watch what you're, what do you think? Cause there's also people on high level who just like started off making Tik Toks and now make seven figures a year and they've never built a business in their life.

Keaton:

Yeah.

Matt:

Except for the one they have, which is literally better than 99 percent of businesses, which is just affiliate.

Keaton:

Yeah. Fortunately or unfortunately, no, you don't have to. And some people like, like I, one of my mentors posted this the other day, I really liked it. He's like the fact that the coach makes more money coaching agency owners than the agency makes being an agency.

Matt:

It's the point.

Keaton:

I don't make the rules, but this is, this is how it works. And it used to bother me. I used to be like, it's not right. It's this like MLM slash this incestuous community where everybody's just buying from each other and all of this. And then I zoomed out and I was like, that's all the corporate world is like, there's five more zeros after it. And yeah, I don't like, it's just, this money is going to to get thrown around anyway, you may as well take a piece of it. And if respect matters more to you than just like a monthly paycheck, then sure. Like really go down the entrepreneurship route because there are people that won't respect you as much because you haven't built a real business and they'll talk about you behind your back. And

Matt:

does that happen to you?

Keaton:

I'm not saying to me, but you've

Matt:

actually built a real business.

Keaton:

Yeah. But like even in the grand scheme of things, like my business was quote real, but it wasn't that big. You know, the sale wasn't insanely. You've

Matt:

already made more from affiliate.

Keaton:

Yeah, exactly. Like profit wise, I don't know. Profit. Yeah. Profit wise, probably just barely crossed that. But, um, like, I don't know, like there's, there's a lot to be said for just like giving the middle finger to everybody and like doing what feels right for you. Um, even if. You know, it's not technically illegal, but it's it feels a little bit unethical. It feels a little bit sleazy like I'm not condoning that. I'm just saying

Matt:

what affiliate marketing can feel sleazy.

Keaton:

I'm I'm saying if someone's never built an agency

Matt:

Oh, yeah, they're like, oh do I deserve to push this?

Keaton:

Yeah. I mean it's better than a coaching program probably.

Matt:

Yeah Yeah, I mean my thought is Affiliate marketing, in the way that you're doing it, I don't see how it could be unethical. Like, people can cancel anytime.

Keaton:

Yeah, I don't feel it's unethical for me. I'm just saying, you're saying like Even

Matt:

if you don't have a business, even if you never built a business, Affiliate marketing in general, if you get somebody to sign up for a software that they enjoy, you're just, you're Essentially an outsourced marketing representative of the company.

Keaton:

Yeah,

Matt:

like you you are just that's your form of payment You're marketing Congratulations, you've figured out what a lot of people get paid a hundred two hundred thousand dollars a year to go do it corporate

Keaton:

Yeah

Matt:

companies is oh, let's figure out. How can we get people to sign up for our service or product online? You've just figured that out and your payment is performance based.

Keaton:

Yeah,

Matt:

that's really what it is You're a performance based marketing representative for a high level or for you know Point wise or for whatever software or company. No, it's it's yeah, I don't Yeah, I don't think it's unethical at all. I don't even think coaching programs are unethical. I think there's just bad People in all areas and they ruin the taste in everybody's mouth.

Keaton:

This is what it is. I heard it today It's not the coaching. It's the promises. It's not the affiliate marketing It's the promises and high levels cracking down on this big time. Like they're they're like, hey You can't claim this like don't or don't directly compare us just like they do on those ads like Clorox wipes versus the competitor like they don't put the logos of the competitor, right? And You Um, but like what bothers me, I don't, I don't have a problem with somebody not building an agency and pushing high level. I do have a problem with make 500 a day overnight with this one software that's beginner friendly. Like it's just, and, and, and high level is cracking down on it. That's good. Yeah,

Matt:

that's good that they are. Yeah. Um, I've noticed you take the anti approach to that too, which is like, You said something in one of your videos about like, Hey, I hope your affiliate didn't tell you this was going to be easy. And I was like, I like that. That's like, that's like what I do with the gurus. I'm like, I hope you, your course seller didn't tell you an agency was going to make you rich in 30 days. So it's kind of the same thing. Now it's fun. It's like the affiliate marketing world is now, I guess, well, it's always been kind of like the biz op world in general, people making crazy claims and promises.

Keaton:

But there's, there's so many, I mean, if you, if you happen to choose affiliate marketing as your very first venture, there's, there's plenty of people that do that and build up like insane businesses doing that. Like they're just living in the shadows of like these people that are selling, you know, a hundred million dollar companies. Like for every one of those, there's this other guy that like, Spends eight hours a day on his hobbies and two hours a day working. And it's pretty incredible. Yeah. He's, he's made, he's been making a full time income for 10 years and like, he just sort of fell into it and like, there's, there's all these niches, like whatever you want to push dog food, whatever it is, like there's a way to promote an affiliate product doing it. And, um, I think it's, it's becoming a really good way to get started. And. It's also, because a lot of them are microtransactions, it teaches you a lot more about generating a customer via the internet versus having to go through sales calls, which a lot of agency stuff happens to go through, and you're like, oh, it's not worth it to do something that's low ticket like that, but like, I'd rather learn how to generate a hundred low ticket sales without ever having to talk to someone than doing one high ticket. Sale and always having to be chained to the desk in terms of sales.

Matt:

It is a really good point. That's what's so attractive to me about software in general. Um, as much as I want to be the guy who like builds the a hundred million dollar company, I, I a hundred percent get the appeal of, Hey, let's, you know, let's sell the shovel instead of digging for the gold. Right. And it makes a lot of sense. And uh, it's really cool to hear more about. Um, Anything, any final words of wisdom that you'd like to leave people with or, um, any final areas you would want to take this?

Keaton:

I would say give yourself permission to do what's right for you and stop deferring to your guru.

Matt:

Wow. Dude, I think that's like the perfect summary of this podcast, honestly.

Keaton:

Yeah, yeah, because it's

Matt:

Wow.

Keaton:

Like, for me, as I look into the future, I don't I'm finding more and more I don't care about building the multi million dollar company. I don't care about the big sale. Like, I'm interested in having conversations like this, building real connections. I'm planning on moving back to my home state, and I want to start a podcast that's like Interviews with entrepreneurs from my home state. So it's just all around that community aspect, like community, um, people that you can be yourself around and like a steady high income paycheck that doesn't require you to be slaving behind a desk every single day. Like those three things, you'd be pretty happy. You'll be able to figure out most things in your life. But I know a lot of people who are. Rich and have no community. And that's like, if you want to avoid that day where you wake up and you have all the money in the world, but you're not happy, it has a lot to do with who you surround yourself with. Yeah. And that's what I'm more interested in building in the next 10, 20 years of my life than a multi bajillion dollar company.

Matt:

I respect it, dude. I respect it. I respect the way you're building your business and the way you're building your life. To be honest, it's very, very cool. Yeah. And I hope people will have enlightened perspectives. Uh, and Layton's a strong word, but you know what I mean enhanced perspectives from this conversation. Thanks, man. And uh, Yeah, guys keaton's youtube will be linked below Instagram got instagram instagram will be linked below um ghl affiliate link And you know i'll put your ghl affiliate link in here if we also put in your point wise affiliate link. All right, sounds

Keaton:

good

Matt:

Oh, no, we guys check the links below to check out keaton's, uh, youtube channel and Hope you guys got some value out of this. We're out. Much love. Peace. Don't follow your guru, follow your dreams. Well, that was cool. It's such a, it's so much different than any. You know how my buddy Elijah made one of his agency clients a hundred thousand dollars in their first 30 days with him? All he did was he ran your normal Facebook and Instagram ads. He used to go high level But then he implemented the software called appoint wise to nurture all of the leads for the client So appoint wise uses AI technology and what Elijah set it up to do Is engage qualify and book the leads for the client on their behalf and it works so well The client made a hundred grand in the first 30 days So if you guys want to see how it works check it out The link is in the description below if you're not using this for your clients right now You're missing out and your clients are missing out, too